"Do I take one on three season trips which it could end up in the backpack? No. Do I take it on winter trips when I will need at least it all the time? Absolutely.

--Mark"


Mark, once again you've summed this up in one (half) paragraph.

Softshells, unlike hardshells, are for wearing, not carrying. They're best used when you'll have them on for the whole trip, +/- other layers.

I would never PACK my softshell jacket (OR pants when I think about it) If I'm not wearing them as I walk away from the car/trailhead, I don't need them. Sure I may occasionally take them off if it really heats up or I'm working hard for a long time, but I'd be considering this to be a reason to reexamine my gearlist when I got home for this location/trips next time. ie, I made a mistake this time. That's okay, mistakes are a way to learn what works. Plus, it's pretty hard to make mistakes about what to wear for sitting at home in front of the TV (or computer) :^)

Edited by Rod_Lawlor on 11/22/2008 20:05:19 MST.

Broadly agree with best worn not carried, especially with the heavier ones.

One thing you can do with shelled micropile - like the Vapour rise, Montane Scarab, lighter weight Buffalos etc - is to wear it next to the skin.

It works very well - indeed probably best - like this and it also of course extends the comfortable temperature range a fair bit, especially on ones with side vents.

I'd probably be happy setting off in one if I knew the temperature wasn't going to go above 60 or so and was expected to be a little lower.

Very useful in the sort of rather changeable, on/off showery conditions often seen in the UK. Rather less so in more stable climates I'd imagine.

A while back, Ryan posted about using the Patagonia Essenshell as a tougher windshirt/softshell for cold conditions. However, it looks like the Essenshell is no longer being made. What has taken its place? Are there similiar pieces being made by other manufacturers?

I notice the Patagonia Ready Mix and Cloudveil Inertia Hooded Jacket might be similar, but I'm not that up on softshell materials. What is inertia like relative to Scoeler or Powershield etc.?

I believe the essenshell went through many versions and eventually become the Ready Mix. My essenshell, which is a simple pullover, is a non-stretch polyester that- I believe- has an Epic coating. It is nothing like the Epic Malibu I have used, but is windproof and sheds light rain, but does not breathe as well as the Ready Mix. Still, it's light, has a helmet compatible hood, and is tough. Damn ugly color though (greenish yellow).

In my opinion, Inertia is more like Schoeller Dryskin than the Ready Mix fabric in that it is stretchier, not %100 windproof, but very breathable. The Ready Mix is less stretchy, more windproof but slightly less breathable. The nice thing about Inertia is that it all Polyester with mechanical stretch- better drying than Schoeller. These excell for high exertion activities.

Powershield has a membrane- unlike the other fabrics mentioned here.

Thanks Michael. Very helpful.

I'm looking around for heavier wind shirt/sort shell like the Essenshell of Ready Mix. I want to use it for snowshoeing this winter as my Montane Litespeed just isn't up to snuff for the coldest parts of the winter.

Unfortunately it looks like the Ready Mix isn't available anymore either. (Anyone know what's up with that?)

Do you think that the Ready Mix would perform about the same as shells made from Schoeller Dryskin or Inertia for snowshoeing in cold that's too extreme for lighter wind shells?

I asked Patagonia when I saw that the Ready Mix was off the website- they said it was part of their spring line and would be back for that season. Incidently, the Ascentionist appears to be a heavy-duty Ready Mix, and I seriously want one for ice climbing (Rock and Snow has them if you want to try one on). Note that my RM has some abrasion damage from normal use with a pack (from the sternum strap) and where the velcro rubs the fabric on the wrists. I have also experienced this with Schoeller Dynamic.

If you don't need the hood, check Ebay and such for the Patagonia Figure 4- same fabric as used in the reinforeced parts of the Ready Mix, weighs under one pound, and is durable. They go for pretty cheap.

Edit: I notice that we travel in the same areas for winter (cats and Dacks). For me, it is a toss up whether I take my Ready Mix or my Schoeller Dryskin Extreme jacket on backcountry trips in those areas. The RM is the perfect all around shell- dries fast, blocks wind, good features, decent breathability. The Schoeller fits better, moves better and is more breathable, but blocks less wind and water. If I could only have one, it would be the Ready Mix, but when snowshoeing up hill on the straight-up trails in the Cats/Dacks with a winter pack stuffed for three days, the Schoeller is really nice for moisture control. This is where Powershield fails for me- my back is soaked in sweat no matter what the temperature or my baselayer.
If I am going to be above treeline much I take the RM for the wind protection- otherwise I often opt for the Schoeller Dryskin (dont like dynamic) for the fit/breathability.

Last note: as much as I like Schoeller Dryskin, I would not buy a shell made from it again. It is too pricey and heavy- Patagonia, Cloudveil (Inertia) and Mountain Hardwear all have similar fabrics that cost much less. Look for any stretch-woven lacking a membrane.

Edit again: If you are ever in Delaware Water Gap, PA and want to see a Ready Mix, Schoeller Dryskin jacket, Figure 4, Gamma MX, Essenshell, and some other softshells, let me know.

Edited by febbom on 12/17/2008 10:37:26 MST.

Michael: Thanks, that was just the info I was looking for.

If you're interested, we should do a hike together. I'm trying to find some partners for snowshoeing in the Cats and Dacks.

Dave

I just had a thought: I wonder how a single layer ventile smock would work in place of the Ready Mix or Ascentionist. Or the Schoeller or Inertia for that matter.

Anybody tried this?

No thanks on softshell jackets. 30* and some flurries and after an hour of hiking my softshell was heavy with moisture on the exterior. For the next 8 hours (Mt. Rainier) all I could think about was what a mistake it was to rent this high-end MH softshell. Yes, I was fairly dry inside but the jacket was heavy as heck! All my teammates had rented the same one and it looked cool and I went against my conventional wisdom: aim for high breathability first, then protection against the elements and finally never, EVER wear anything that will absorb moisture.

Since then my system is as follows: synthetic T or LS, Ibex merino LS top, cheap 100 wt fleece (if temps are below 30*), eVENT hardshell and finally an insulated parka.