Wow... Ti Esbit... days with no comments?
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Joshua Mitchell
(jdmitch) - F

Locale: Kansas
Wow... Ti Esbit... days with no comments? on 11/17/2005 07:18:49 MST Print View

Did no-one else notice this picture on the BPL front page?

It's been there for a couple of days and I haven't seen any comments yet.

Michael Freyman
(mfreyman) - MLife
Re: Wow... Ti Esbit... days with no comments? on 11/17/2005 16:38:21 MST Print View

Just waiting for a price before I get excited.

Ryan Faulkner
(ryanf) - F

Locale: Mid atlantic, No. Cal
Re: Re: Wow... Ti Esbit... days with no comments? on 11/17/2005 16:50:21 MST Print View

looks like a simple design,
I wonder if BPL could sell the design template for a little cheaper price so people could make their own, with titamium from thru-hiker.com?

Edited by ryanf on 11/17/2005 16:51:00 MST.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
Ti Esbit on 11/17/2005 17:18:58 MST Print View

It looks like something Sgt Rock might have come up with.

I see no reason why you couldn't take a few pieces of paper and in a few tries make a pattern that would work.

Ryan Faulkner
(ryanf) - F

Locale: Mid atlantic, No. Cal
Re: Ti Esbit on 11/17/2005 17:56:09 MST Print View

true, ill try that

Jim Colten
(jcolten) - M

Locale: MN
MYOG Ti Esbit stove on 11/17/2005 17:58:57 MST Print View

Thru-hiker not only sells Ti, he has wing stove instructions template included. Says it weighs in at 0.3oz, which would be approx 8.4grams

But after materials cost+shipping and the cost of a carbide tipped drill bit I doubt the cost savings would be much. But HEY!, MYOG is its own reward for those of us with that in our nature.

David Lewis
(davidlewis) - MLife

Locale: Nova Scotia, Canada
Re: MYOG Ti Esbit stove on 11/17/2005 18:22:19 MST Print View

Too bad it's far too big for a Fosters / Heineken pot :( It does look like it would be easy to make tho'.

Edited by davidlewis on 11/17/2005 18:23:12 MST.

David Lewis
(davidlewis) - MLife

Locale: Nova Scotia, Canada
Re: Wow... Ti Esbit... days with no comments? on 11/17/2005 18:34:59 MST Print View

Does anyone know the URL for the page? It doesn't appear to by on the homepage anymore... and it's not in the gear shop... and I've since deleted the email notice about it :(

Ryan Jordan
(ryan) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Greater Yellowstone
Ti Esbit: Member's URL on 11/17/2005 19:24:18 MST Print View

Here's the URL's from today's member's email, login as a Premium Member is required.

David Lewis
(davidlewis) - MLife

Locale: Nova Scotia, Canada
Windscreen strength? on 11/18/2005 04:27:35 MST Print View

I wonder how strong that Ti foil is? I currently use aluminum from a dispoasable cookie sheet. According to my micrometer... it's 0.004". This Ti foil is 0.03 mm which converts to 0.001". So... much thinner. However, Ti is much stronger than soft aluminum. I'm wondering since my beer can pot stove design uses a "tent stakes thru the windscreen" design as a pot holder. I wonder if this Ti foil would be strong enough to be used in a similar fashion. At 0.001"... I doubt it... but you never know. Ti is significantly stronger than Al. One sweet combo would be this foil with a Ti esbit stove/stand sized for beer can pots.

Edited by davidlewis on 11/18/2005 04:28:07 MST.

Joshua Mitchell
(jdmitch) - F

Locale: Kansas
Re: Ti Esbit: Member's URL on 11/18/2005 07:15:48 MST Print View

Just got my email this morning. Kudos.

I'll probably buy one with XMas money.

Ryan Jordan
(ryan) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Greater Yellowstone
Re: Windscreen strength? on 11/18/2005 08:58:22 MST Print View

>> I wonder how strong that Ti foil is?

It's very strong. It doesn't crumple or fall like aluminum foil. It's definitely has the properties of a sheet metal that way. It's thinner than your cookie sheet material but easily stands up on its own. See the bottom photo on the page description.

John Chan
(ouroboros)
Titanium windscreen tempering... memory metal on 11/18/2005 09:59:58 MST Print View

I wonder if its possible to temper the windscreen with heat so that it retains its pre-temper shape. That way, the windscreen just "springs" back into the perfect diammeter when you remove it from your cooking pot.

...it seems to apply to eyeglass frames, or is that related to a special alloy of titanium?

Ryan Jordan
(ryan) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Greater Yellowstone
Re: Titanium windscreen tempering... memory metal on 11/18/2005 10:29:09 MST Print View

You can, yes, but you lose the ability to then cut it to the diameter you need for the pot you are using. You'd have to pretemper it for each pot size.

Joshua Mitchell
(jdmitch) - F

Locale: Kansas
tempering at home? on 11/18/2005 10:51:29 MST Print View

Would it be possible to temper the metal to spring / hold at home with a torch?

John Chan
(ouroboros)
Re: tempering at home? on 11/18/2005 11:30:02 MST Print View

I believe (I'm no expert though) that the success of tempering is critically dependent on the rate of change of the temperature of the metal dT/dt and that this change must be consistent throughout the piece. That's how you get crappy rotors (bad temper, fast) vs good rotors (good temper, slower) on automobiles.

You could try it at home but if you know someone who's into pottery perhaps you could convince them to fire it in an electric or gas kiln. That would be preferable as you can control temperature (but with the thin nature of the metal you have much less control over rate of cooling unless you have another oven available at a lower post-temper temperature).

Edited by ouroboros on 11/18/2005 11:32:11 MST.

Vick Hines
(vickrhines) - F

Locale: Central Texas
Aluminum windscreen on 11/18/2005 15:05:58 MST Print View

Aluminum windscreens have the virtue of being crushable once they have lost their factory hardness. After a couple of uses the heat of the stove softens the aluminum so it can be crushed, mangled, and folded to fit wherever it needs to go. This is fine if the windscreen is not supporting anything.

Newly cut from oven liner or cookie sheets, aluminum will retain the hardness conferred by rolling and shaping (called 'use' hardening or 'hammer' hardening). Aluminum and other nonferrous metals harden like that. Heat anneals (softens)them. Their behavior is opposite that of steel.

David Lewis
(davidlewis) - MLife

Locale: Nova Scotia, Canada
Re: Re: tempering at home? on 11/18/2005 15:32:58 MST Print View

Anyone care to take an educated guess as to what the "baking" proceedure (temps & times) would be for Ti foil?

By the way... as I posted elsewhere... if I can use these Ti products to make my stove design... my cook kit would go down to 44 grams total! That's for a pot, lid, stand, windscreen, esbit holder, pot grabber and an elastic band to hold it all together when packed up. Nice :) I've never worked with Ti before though. Hopefully it's doable with normal home tools.

Edited by davidlewis on 11/18/2005 15:38:18 MST.

John Chan
(ouroboros)
Re: Re: Re: tempering at home? on 11/18/2005 19:22:15 MST Print View

It appears the minimum temperature would be 200 C and maximum temperature for a hardening effect is in the 550 C range.

From:

http://www.osti.gov/energycitations/product.biblio.jsp?osti_id=4172131

abstract.