> "Just a headsup that BPL will release its new "Thorofare" Collection of trekking apparel to Members only on 8/22 ...."

I can't say that I have ants in my pants about this, especially since I can't buy the pants yet :-)

Just wondering if this roll-out is on schedule or not?

Hi Michael,

They're posted for sale now. Got the email a little while ago and ordered a set already.

In the short time I have been a member, there have been two big announcements of clothing marketed by BPL, and in both cases there were only men's sizes available. How far have we come here, gents? I remember having to go to the mat with REI to get them to carry technical mountaineering boots in women's sizes, but that was about twenty years ago. If you look around out there, you will notice that a)there are lots of women out there on the trail, and right here in BPL and b)we are shaped differently. Any interest in marketing to us, too? Just an idea...

I'm not on the staff so I can't answer for them but I can see a couple of reasons things are generally designed for men. One is money. The ROI on clothing for men is going to be higher than the ROI on clothing for women, at least in perception due to the numbers thing. The other reason is I only know of 3 females on staff and I only know for sure that one is a backpacker which makes it much harder to have a test pool. On the up side, there is at least 1 female on the newly formed design team so there could be female-specific clothing in the future.

Is there any reason you haven't said what fabric is used? Or is this info a trade secret? :)

Yep, there's my email notice! I just ordered a pair of pants. Now I can truly have ants in my pants :-)

Okay so say I'm a 5'11" hiker with a 30" waist and 34.5" inseam. What size pants should I order? I'm thinking small or medium?

Will these things hold up to light scrambling on rock?

Wow. I'd say you're a small in the waist but XXL in the inseam. A medium is probably the best compromise but will likely be a little short.

Yes I'm a tall(ish) skinny ultra dork. :) A little short is okay honestly. I hack most of my summer stuff to 3/4 length anyway, at least for the mountains.

I'm a little odd sized myself. If you're not worried about length a small might work. I tried a small cocoon pro pant and it was a little snug so I stepped up to a medium. The thorofare pant is sized the same. I'm around a 32 waist but have larger than average legs.

Seem kinda expensive.

And I do believe that we have a matter of weight proportion here: just as a pound on the feet is equivalent to a few on the back, I think a pound in clothing is maybe an ounce on the back. Especially when I can get a supplex nylon shirt from Academy for $15 or for $12 from EMS clearance, this doesn't really seem like a good allocation of my resources to achieve lighter weight.

But that's just my take.

Hmm..

Well, I don't think the price is too bad considering the price of other pants in the market. I mean you'd pay $40-$50 for a pair of pants if you get them when they are on sale at some normal sale, or maybe for even less if you get them at a great sale. So $65 doesn't seem TOO crazy to pay for a pair of pants that are light and perform well. I hike in pants and I think a light pair that is durable would be awesome so I may get these, I'll have to decide if they are worth the cost. I like to try my pants on. I tried on the REI sahara pants (those convertible ones, I think that is what they are called) and they fit SO baggy that I couldn't get them. I'd hate to order these pants and have them fit in a way that wasn't what I wanted.

Also, just a note for the folks at BPL, I looked pretty closely and couldn't find an example of which color was which. I assume the Sepia is darker, but maybe this could be made more clear.

I'm considering these. I hope I can get some after waiting to see what the initial reviews are as I'm too poor to be a tester of the first run.

Edited by arichardson6 on 08/22/2008 17:37:47 MDT.

Show me another lightweight, button-up shirt that's breathable AND mosquito-proof - at any price - and I, for one, would like to see the size of the rock it's been hiding under.

Edited by blister-free on 08/22/2008 18:18:39 MDT.

Andrew,

Sepia is a medium-dark brown with a tinge of grey. It's my favorite color in any BPL gear we've made, and was inspired by the color of a RIT-dyed shirt that Don Ladigin wore on a Teton High Route trek we took together several years ago. I didn't forget your shirt, Don!

Desert Tan is, well, tan. It too has a tinge of grey, so it's more like sandstone than tan.

Thanks Ryan! I figured the darker color was Sepia, but just wanted to make sure. It looks like a really beautiful color! I think you made a really good decision to remember that shirt and create one with a similar color!

The reason we haven't yet introduced lightweight clothing for women is because of the economies of scale - and I'm not talking about production run minimums so much as achieving those economies during design and development.

I want to make sure we can deliver, and standardize, decent sizing on mens/unisex apparel, and then extend those garments en masse to women's designs. It's easier for us to extend a number of garments at once into women's sizing rather than try to do it one product line at a time.

Having said that, we have two more key apparel lines to release before we introduce women's sizing to market.

In addition, there simply hasn't been much demand for them through our forums (two here, good!) or our customer support channels. If that demand increases, then the spark that exists now may actually turn into a flame.

Ryan,

I have read all about the shirt and pants several times hoping I missed something about a "fly" on the pants and sewn in briefs.

I am thinking about a set of these but I would have to modify the pants with the two items as mentioned above. I expect I could get by with a pair of silk boxers and give up the sewn in briefs but would sure add a fly on the pants

In designing these two items did you considered a fly and or sewn in briefs?

I can see all kinds of layering possibilities using this shirt and pants with a set of merino underwear for cooler weather.

I think a really good Sub 5 pound gear list for 4 seasons is just around the corner.

Bill, these pants have neither a fly nor sewn in briefs.

While I did consider both during the design, the real goal was to create something that reflected that tenet of "simplicity".

In looking at other pants on the market, I found many of them that had a fly, a brief liner, belt loops, ankle snaps, a second cargo pocket, rear pocket, felted waist liner, knee patches, butt patches, instep patches, etc. etc.

So during design I started hacking those things out, deciding that these pants wouldn't need things. That is backwards to me, so I abandoned that approach and went back to the drawing board with a pair of pull-on pants, and added back only a few things (a few pockets, drawcord).

What I wanted:

Protection from sun, wind, and biting insects for minimal weight.

I had a hard time putting pockets on them even! :)

OK, back to seriousness. Regarding the brief liner, those of us who do wear a separate boxer/brief (stay tuned for a Merino UL version in 2009, mayyyyybe...) would have to cut out a mesh liner in the pant. I think many folks will be able to go commando in these well enough, too, with the absence of the fly.

The combination of the Merino UL and the Thorofare shirt/pants are terrific for cool weather. They are very comfortable for walking, hanging out, sleeping, with the warm inner lining and slicker outer surface that's not clammy like an outer shell of wind/rainwear.

Ryan

Edited by ryan on 08/23/2008 09:59:08 MDT.

A note on the sizing of Backpacking Light's new Thorofare Collection. There was some confusion over body-sizing vs. garment sizing. I've adjusted the sizing charts to reflect body-sizing for the new Thorofare Collection pieces.

People are generally familiar with body-sizing as it is the industry standard in sizing clothing. Simply measure your body and compare see where you fit within the figures located in the sizing chart located under the heading of the particular piece you are interested in.

Some of the other charts on the sizing chart page are based on garment sizing which is to say the measurements are based on the size of the actual piece of clothing. The sizing charts are noted as such if this is the case. Sorry for the confusion.

Hi Ryan,

Thanks for the quick reply.

I agree that in this case "simplicity" equals lighter weight.

I just weighed the Patagonia silk boxers I had on - they weigh 4 ounces. I have some Patagonia Capilene briefs, they weigh 1.67 ounces. The capilene briefs might work if I found it necessary to wear something under the pants. These are both size medium.

The merino boxers/briefs sound like something to look forward to.

My birthday was this past Thursday. Looks like a new shirt and pair of pants will be a gift to myself.