Is the new Vargo canister stove going to be included in the upcoming canister stove review?

Edited by mcg11 on 01/18/2005 19:17:25 MST.

I certainly hope so! It seems a little foolish to push a product without a thorough testing and evaluation. As well as being a few tenths of an ounce heavier than the Snow Peak Giga ti stove, it looks like it would sit higher on the cannister and suffer in the stability department vs. the Snow Peak Giga.

We're cautious about reviewing products we sell. It would be easy to include the Jet-Ti in our canister stove product reviews, but it would certainly serve the "store's" best interests to make sure it reviewed well. (That's not to say it wouldn't be reviewed fairly - our review staff and our retail staff are completely insulated from each other. In fact, the retail staff seeks guidance from the review staff on which products to carry in the store.) The point is, if it reviewed negatively, then we wouldn't carry it in our store, as I'm not really interested in selling crappy products at BPL! And, if it reviewed well, there would be this perception that "of course it reviewed well, they sell it!" And so, it's simply a better deal all around if we don't cross those lines. Of course, we might stock products that prove themselves over and again long after we review them, but you're not going to find us submitting products currently in our store to our review program to be reviewed side by side with others.

And so, we'll try to post honest evaluations of the products we sell in the store on those product pages, and also discuss the limitations of those products there. Sort of a mini-review, but certainly not the type you'd find in a formal product review. Case in point, the Triad Stove. It's not a bad product, but if you don't understand the stoves quirks, you won't "get" the mileage out of it you might expect. So, we try to educate the customer a bit, so they absolutely understand a product's limitations, and how to navigate through them, before they buy. And there, we diverge from the model other retailers take, most of whom simply copy and paste manufacturer marketing copy into their product descriptions and call it good. You can do that for some products, but others certainly deserve more attention and require some honest consumer education.

As for the Jet-Ti: The few mm height over some other canister stoves makes no meaningful difference in pot stability; rather, the width (diameter) of the pot supports, and their ability to maintain a grip on pots, plays a much higher role. In that respect, the Jet-Ti keeps pots stable a bit better than some other stoves out there.

OK, here's a personal opinion, completely unrelated to the formal canister stove reviews being released, which I did not take part in: I've been a Snow Peak Giga Power stove user since it came out, and have found nothing that's either (a) as light, or (b) as small, or (c) as functional for the weight. That's five? six? years of hard use. I've recently switched to the Jet-Ti and I think I've found a replacement. I toyed with a Coleman F1 Ultralight for awhile, but the construction quality of the Jet-Ti is much nicer, it feels more durable, it's made with higher quality materials, its construction and design are simpler. It offers far better pot stability than the Snow Peak Giga Power, and seems more durable, and the 0.2 oz weight penalty was worth it, to gain these advantages.

The fact that I carried a Giga for 5-6 years, even after trying every canister stove that came out in the interim, is testament to the awesome design of the Snow Peak as well. It's been a great stove that has served me very well.

Edited by ryan on 02/10/2005 23:06:05 MST.

Thank you for your honesty, Ryan. It's refreshing to see that in retailing (which is what we're talking about here). Profit over honesty is why I quit working for a couple of major companies (which will remain unnamed), in the past.

Would it be possible to post boil times of the stove, both with a fresh cannister and, say 1 hour later, just to give us an idea of what to expect?

I currently own a Pocket Rocket, and, other than its flimsy supports, am happy with it. I need a very good reason for going with something new. It would have to be lighter and perform BETTER in some way.

Thanks again.
Dan

Where is it made (and if you know, where is the Pocket Rocket made)? I like to keep my money onshore if I can, even if I have to pay more.

Is it possible to get boil times for the Jet-ti stove?

If the stove was tested side by side with the other cannister stoves in the recent tests, would it have fared better than, or as well as, the Coleman stove?

It's my suspicion that the stove was tested right along side the others, but that BPL is witholding test results due to the fact that the stoves are sold here. Am I correct?

Edited by danscapes49 on 02/18/2005 07:31:18 MST.

fr/the BPL product description:

# Sturdy one piece ti legs swivel in for compact storage
# Output: 9,000 BTU/hr
# Manual ignition
**************************************************
# Boils a liter of water in approx. 4 minutes
**************************************************
# Precise flame adjustments for simmer or boil
# Includes attractive nylon carrying case
# Size: 2 3/4" high x 3 1/2" top diameter

(above asterisks mine)

test conditions not described.
hope this helps.

Edited by pj on 02/18/2005 15:55:51 MST.

Vargo Jet-Ti stove. So what if you have a conflict. We know that. Give us your best advice and we will act accordingly. If it is superior in some respects and inferior in others just say it. Your disclosure of your conflict ie that you sell it for profit and provide research on it as well, "cures" you from any criticism on the conflict. It works for Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, and everybody else in America. If you eat your own cooking, which you do, tell us why. Skip

A short time back I read a post that expressed one of my concerns. The writer encouraged BPL to include products that you sell in comparative reviews. I could not agree more. I believe that you choose product to sell because you feel they are a good choice for many of your constituents. In my opinion you also conduct the most thorough product reviews available. I think that you need only indicate in a review which products you also sell. Buyers can use their own judgment about whether that factor is going to make a difference in how much they trust the review. By not including those products, you leave a hole in each review you publish for a category in which you also make available a product.

Terry Dussault

I agree; I think it will hurt sales to not include items you sell in reviews; without a frame of reference, we are essentially being encouraged to buy an item from your reviews, not from your store.

Ryan, I just sold my Pocket Rocket, and I was wondering if the Jet-ti gets the same, or better fuel efficiency. If the pot supports on the Pocket Rocket weren't so flimsy, I wouldn't have sold it, and am wondering if I did the right thing. It appears to be the most fuel efficient, and wind resistant of the stoves tested, though not the lightest or most compact.

If the efficiency of the Jet-ti matches the Pocket Rocket, I might buy one. If not, not. It has two things going for it (according to me), apparant durability and weight.

My other option is to stick with my Whisperlite for winter use, and my various alcohol stoves for warmer weather.

Or........... I could just buy another Pocket Rocket. :|

What's your take on this?

Thanks in advance.