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Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
SUL hammocks on 05/24/2008 05:36:38 MDT Print View

I would like to know who out there makes or is willing to make a SUL hammock that would fit my size (6'3'', 180 lbs., preferred hammock width 4'6'') and that weighs 8 oz or less (including hanging system), and if this is even possible at all. I've seen some pictures of cuben fiber hammocks around here, but have these even been tested and are they practical? Is someone making them? Maybe we can gather some info on SUL hammocks in this thread. I think a lot of people would be interested.

Edited by Legkohod on 05/24/2008 05:37:37 MDT.

Devin Montgomery
(dsmontgomery) - MLife

Locale: one snowball away from big trouble
Re: SUL hammocks on 05/24/2008 20:28:20 MDT Print View

Bill Fornshell is your guy for... well all things cuben fiber. He has the details of how he made his cuben hammock here: http://ultraliteskunkworks.blogspot.com/2007/03/cuben-fiber-hammock.html
His, with hanging sys. came in at just 6.95 oz!

Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
Re: Re: SUL hammocks on 05/24/2008 23:22:39 MDT Print View

Thanks, Devin. I've sent him a message now. Is he the only brave soul using cuben? :)

Devin Montgomery
(dsmontgomery) - MLife

Locale: one snowball away from big trouble
Re: Re: Re: SUL hammocks on 05/26/2008 09:53:58 MDT Print View

You're welcome. On that blog, he refers to a friend who is also making a hammock out of cuben, so there's at least two. It seems dodgy to me, but I'm a lowly ground sleeper. :)

Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
Re: Re: Re: Re: SUL hammocks on 05/26/2008 10:11:40 MDT Print View

I have the feeling Bill has already left for his AT trek. Hopefully, his cuben creations are serving him well :)

I'd just like to get some feedback from people who sleep in cuben hammocks, especially about condensation issues. 8 oz is a very minimal weight penalty for using a hammock over, say, a 2 oz polycro ground sheet.

Beyond that, the coolest thing would be to have a cuben fiber hammock that converts into a tarp, and also into a poncho. I think my brain's going to crack over that idea.

mark cole
(marklivia)
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: SUL hammocks on 05/26/2008 10:41:53 MDT Print View

I use a Hennessey Adventure racer hammock (started off at 15.5 oz.) and made a cuben fly for it. I think it lost about 3-4 oz. Great design, comfy, and now pretty darn light.

Alan Hughes
(natchez) - F

Locale: South
Hammock on 05/26/2008 14:05:00 MDT Print View

If you tune a travel hammock (campmor) replace the lines with a light line it comes in at 9-10oz I think it is a lot more comfy and stronger then a cuben Hammock would be and only 1-2oz more they are rated for 250lbs

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
SUL hammocks on 05/26/2008 16:46:53 MDT Print View

I have been following this thread and the other one about a really light weight Quilt.

For Rick who said I might have left for my AT hike - No.

I have lived with cancer for about the last 13 years . I have had it in two different places multiple times and both places at the same time once. My Bladder for one place. I get a bladder exam every three months and on my last exam, the end of March, they found a spot that needed to be removed. Because of more urgent surgery mine was scheduled for mid-April. They also found traces of cancer cells in one of my Kidneys and were going to check that out during my Bladder surgery. Bladder surgery went fine but one of my Kidneys has something in it. A few days later I had a CAT Scan and when it was over I asked the technician if I could look at it. I could see two dark spots in my right Kidney. I don't know what that means but have a consult about all this next week. I expect the spots will be cancer and some action will be suggested to do something about it. So I expect I will not be doing any hiking for awhile.

To Rick,

To answer a few of your questions:

1. I don't make anything to sell.

2. You can / could buy


Buy 54" Cuben Here.

The weigh per sq yard is about 0.44 to 0.47 ounces. This would give you a hammock width close to what you are looking for. If you are worriued about your weight use two layers of Cuben but only sew it on one edge. I used this same Cuben fiber for the Hammock I made. I weigh about 155 so I only used one layer of Cuben. I have slept in it a lot and have NO problems with it. My Hammock is made like the type Ed Speers makes / sells and is so simple that anyone who can tie a knot in their shoes could make one.

3. Gather information on this thread about SUL Hammocks? This web site has a really terrible format for its Forums. I have decide that BLP.com is happy that it is almost impossible to track threads here. They are in the business of selling stuff and when we show how easy it is to make your own gear, make it lighter then most of what they sell, and a lot cheaper, they can't be all that happy.

I have over 50 MYOG threads here and it is almost impossible to find them. That is one of the reasons I started putting everything on my BLOG.

4. Every hobby has its own set of silly things that new folks worry about. For backpacking the standard question is "what about condensation". My first answer to that is that only "girly men worry about condensation". If you want to to hike in a SUL mode you can't worry a lot about things like that, you need to learn how to work with these things when you have to. I have been soaking wet from constant rain that went on for days on end and survived. You think I am now going to worry about a little condensation. I have LEARNED how to wear the Cuben things I have designed so I don't have a lot of moisture from sweat buildup. It is called designing things with proper venting options.

5. Don't confuse sleeping in a open top Cuben Hammock to sleeping inside a HH Condom. That is somewhat of a joke but I think has a bit of truth to it.

6. Rick, your comment that "the coolest thing would be to have a cuben fiber hammock that converts into a tarp, and also into a poncho" is not to far off and something that is being work on. More Cape than Poncho however.

7. You are in goods hands with anything Aaron has to say.

Peter Surna
(PedroArvy) - MLife

Locale: Melbourne
For Mark on 05/26/2008 17:52:38 MDT Print View

Mark,

I have a few questions for you about your Hennessey Racer.

1. How tall are you and what is your weight? I am 5’10” and about 165 pounds and wondering whether this thing will break on me.

2. I have heard that the racer is not asymmetrical and you have a curve in your back when you sleep. Is that true and if so, what’s the degree of discomfort?

Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
Re: SUL hammocks on 05/26/2008 21:02:03 MDT Print View

Hello Bill! I am happy to see you around here, but very sorry that you have been held back in your plans. I hope that everything goes well and you are able to continue soon enough.

I realize that making a hammock based on available instructions is a cinch, and I have some MYOG experience. The reason I asked is that I live overseas and will have exactly 1 day in the Denver, Colorado area to do all my errands before beginning a 45-day CDT/CT yo-yo in Colorado. I could order cuben fiber, pick it up in Colorado, and make the hammock that same day, but I will also be stopping by REI, the pharmacy, health foods stores, and a half-dozen other places, in addition to dividing up my provisions for later resupply.

I have seen the questoutfitters page. Their cuben is 4'2'' wide, and I'm pretty sure I can do with that. I don't weigh much more than you -- 170 lb. -- so I would go with one layer. Plus, if what they say about cuben's tear strength is correct, this would be stronger than the parachute nylon used in The Travel Hammock, which I have.

I understand what you say about the forums here. Forums generally aren't the best places for storing accumulated knowledge, and the lack of a sophisticated search here means that you think, "ah, whatever, I'll just start a new thread instead of spending 2 hours sifting through all the threads with the word 'hammock' in them." So blogs or even wikis are the way to go.

4. Yeah, I can relate :) I've never used cuben before and have trouble ordering it from where I am, so I have the Creeping Condensation Concerns, too. However, the idea of having a hammock that blocks wind, is rain-proof from below and saves me the time of jerry-rigging my space blanket shield underneath is really attractive.

6. Yep, I'd imagine you'd want to avoid putting any holes in the construction. So I'd imagine you can put a large side pocket with a drawcord on the hammock, then have this convert into the hood of the poncho. It would hang 50'' down your back, reaching your lower thighs, and the rest of the hammock would drape around the front of you in two overlapping layers. The single back layer could have two clips opposite the hood (i.e. at thigh level) that allow it to be attached to the front layers. Is this what you've had in mind?

As for the tarp mode, you'd have to find some way of working around the fact that the hammock is drawn together at the ends. Untying the hammock to turn it into a tarp is really inconvenient, so what I envision is having four "corner" loops for the tarp right where the hammock begins to taper. This would allow the effective length of the tarp (perhaps 8 feet?) to be pitched tautly, and you'd just have to tie the hammock ends to something to keep them from flopping around. On each side of the hammock you could add, say, 2 more tie-outs (avoiding the hood/pocket) for better tarp pitching.

Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
Re: Hammock on 05/26/2008 21:06:19 MDT Print View

>> If you tune a travel hammock (campmor) replace the lines with a light line it comes in at 9-10oz I think it is a lot more comfy and stronger then a cuben Hammock would be and only 1-2oz more they are rated for 250lbs

Alan, I have that hammock (skeeter beeter, but may buy a no-mesh one). I got it because it fits my height (6'3''). Is there any place that describes the specific mods needed? Or perhaps you could go through the steps here? I'd really appreciate it.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
Re: Re: SUL hammocks on 05/26/2008 22:02:47 MDT Print View

Hi Rick,

Thanks for your concern about my health. I try to deal with my frequent cancer like I do condensation. I do have really great medical and spiritual support so I know that whatever can be done, is, or will be.

I don't know much about the terrain along the CDT/CT so I have to ask a dumb question. Are there enough trees to hang your hammock each night?
Then another one such as "Why the YO-YO" hike? Is it to get you back to the Denver area?

I am sure you will have thought of this - making you hammock / whatever else in some cheap material to work out your pattern before you get here.

It will be interesting seeing what you come up with. I hope you will post pictures when you get everything finished.

Alan Hughes
(natchez) - F

Locale: South
Re: Re: Hammock on 05/26/2008 22:38:58 MDT Print View

Mine is just the travel hammock. It does not have the bug net. I took all the ropes out of it bought some of the ultra light line from a sail boat place it is rated at like 1100 lbs
but is very light. tied a perfection loop in one end threaded it trough the hammock ran it through the hammock. Cut tags out but left the bag on I am at 10.5 oz if you cut the self storage bag off you would be under 10oz with 10 feet of line on both sides of the hammock. I think I have like 25$ in the hammock it is much lighter then my Hennessey backpacker but not as comfy but it is much better then the ground. I am going to take mine on a 100 mile hike next week. I did get one of those bug head nets. In case I run into a bug problem. it is 1/2oz. If you need any help let me know. I also bought some material at Walmart it was 7oz I believe it was 60in wide but it may have been 48 it made a nice hammock I bought like 10 feet I think it was a bit over 3 dollers and took 2 min to make a hammock I was in it with my 3 YO and 7 YO and my 175lb and it held us all. If I where going to use it long term I would want to sew a hem around the whole thing I tied a granny not in each end then did the perfection loop slip not deal worked great.

Every Blessing

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
Re: Hammock on 05/26/2008 23:17:49 MDT Print View

Hi Alan,

Natchez as in MS? I lived there for about 5 years long ago. Ate a lot of really great Cat Fish "Under the Hill" and at a place down the levy on the LA side of the river.

What are you using for rope? It sounds like something I have that came from West Marine. Is it white with a red strip running through it? It will cut most bark and should not be used without some type of protection for the tree.

Are you using tree huggers of some type?

Most of the weight of my Cuben Hammock is in the rope/tree huggers. If I went with just the strongest cord (sounds like what you have) and I didn't worry about cutting a ring in the tree bark my Cuben Hammock would be a couple ounces lighter. That would put it in the under 5 ounce range.

Alan Hughes
(natchez) - F

Locale: South
Bill on 05/27/2008 00:10:06 MDT Print View

I love the cuben hammock I am too cheep to try it. I am sure that the rope is almost the same thing mine is Amsteel Blue 7/64. I have tried it with and with out tree huggers it can leave a scuff on the tree with out. I think I could put something under it to stop it. A 5 oz hammock is great. I do not think it not breathing would be a big deal as a blue pad does not breath either. I do not know how strong Cuben is as I have never played with it but it does sound fragile. You seem to have good luck with it. How wide is your hammock?

I live in GA My first road bike was a Litespeed Natchez should have kept that frame.

Edited by natchez on 05/27/2008 00:11:19 MDT.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
SUL Hammock on 05/27/2008 01:56:35 MDT Print View

Hi Alan,

I should have looked on your profile and I would have seen where you live. I lived in Dahlonega for 11 years and I am sure you know that is. I even saw the Bear the day it was on the Square.

The Cuben I used for my Hammock is 48 inches wide. I have some that is 54 inches wide but I am saving that for a new tarp. Cuben is very strong and you can get it super strong for a bit more $$ per yard.

If you want a really cool (to lay in) Hammock make one out of silk. I have a silk Hammock that is so nice to lay in when it is hot. However, if you are out to cut every possible gram you need to go with Cuben.

Having said that I just had one of those sleep depravation ideas. Hum, got to write it down so I don't forget it. I might get to Sub 1 pound easier than I thought I would.

Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
Re: Re: Re: SUL hammocks on 05/27/2008 02:37:33 MDT Print View

Bill,

I'll be going south on the CT and then back north on the CDT. It's for logistical reasons, and also to enjoy both the lower and the higher portions of the Rockies (the CDT is significantly higher on average). I want to thoroughly immerse myself in the Colorado Rockies -- it's been a dream of mine for years that only became possible after finding out about lightweight gear and thru-hiking.

I'm still waffling about taking a hammock or not on this trip. There should be trees along most of the CT. If the cuben hammock is just as simple as buying tree huggers, some string, and X yards of 50'' wide cuben, I'm all for that. I can always send it home if condensation eats me alive :))) What I won't be able to do are make clever metal pieces like you did on your hammock.

I'd like for it to work. I like the full body rest I get in a hammock. The Travel Hammock mod, albeit much cheaper, sounds almost more complicated than making a new one out of cuben.

mark cole
(marklivia)
Re: For Mark on 05/27/2008 05:50:29 MDT Print View

5' 9" and 145 lbs. I don't think you'll break anything. The Adventure racer seems as comfy as my other HH , just somewhat more cramped as it is smaller.I don't feel more "curved".

Richard Matthews
(food) - F

Locale: Colorado Rockies
Hammock and Colorado Trail on 05/27/2008 08:07:37 MDT Print View

Rick,

Two things.

The Colrado Trail and the CDT are the same trail between Georgia Pass and Twin Lakes Creek (96.2 miles)and then again from the head of Fooses Creek to Bear Town (126.1 miles). At Durango you might want to go east to Wolf Creek Pass to start the CDT.

You will find enough trees to hang every night. You might have to do fewer miles or more miles than you want, but if you watch your elevations you should not have a problem. I have not walked the Cataract Ridge reroute and suspect that from Big Buck Creek to Bear Town might be a problem.

Richard DeLong
(Legkohod) - MLife

Locale: Eastern Europe / Caucasus
Re: Hammock and Colorado Trail on 05/27/2008 12:41:35 MDT Print View

Richard,

>> At Durango you might want to go east to Wolf Creek Pass to start the CDT.

This is one of the things I'd been thinking of, in order to catch more of the San Juans. I know this is outside the scope of this thread, but do you know of any buses that would get me from the Durango trailhead to Wolf Creek Pass? Or will I have to hitchhike?

Thanks for the tips. I realize the trails overlap a lot, and that doesn't bother me :)