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The Carbon Flame War
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Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: no light either. on 11/19/2010 05:59:31 MST Print View

Arapiles says:
The good reasons for incorporation include limiting liability


Yes, I ran my own registered company for 7 years, so I understand the ins and outs of the system.

I do wonder about the effectiveness of fining companies for gross negligence leading to death. The just pass the cost along to the survivors and other consumers of their products.

If the directors knew they might actually spend some time behind bars if they are found culpable, it might lead to less cases where safety corners were cut for purely economic reasons.

The Herald of Free Enterprise springs to mind. (Aptly named ship that was).

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: twinkly lights on the tube on 11/19/2010 11:41:37 MST Print View

Zappa's clarity is refreshing. Thanks RogT!

Business formation focuses on LAWS and ACCOUNTING. Any form of or even lack of a form can make or lose money. This is why lawyers and the accountants run the world!

The reality beyond the enjoyable yet oversimplifed discussions is that trying to understand who owns what is baffling. This can easily be seen by picking any large global corporation and then going to their web site. Go to their Investor Relations. Look at their annual report.

Godspeed...

http://www.aboutmcdonalds.com/etc/medialib/aboutMcDonalds/investor_relations0.Par.17264.File.dat/2009%20AR%20Report%20-%20Print.pdf

an exerpt...

The Company franchises and operates McDonald’s restaurants.
Of the 32,478 restaurants in 117 countries at year-end 2009, 26,216 were operated by franchisees (including 19,020 operated by conventional franchisees, 3,160 operated by developmental licensees and 4,036 operated by foreign affiliated markets (affiliates)—primarily in Japan) and 6,262 were operated by the Company. Under our conventional franchise arrangement, franchisees provide a portion of the capital required by initially investing in the equipment, signs, seating and décor of their restaurant
businesses, and by reinvesting in the business over time.
The Company owns the land and building or secures long-term
leases for both Company-operated and conventional franchised restaurant sites. This maintains long-term occupancy rights, helps control related costs and assists in alignment with franchisees. In certain circumstances, the Company participates in reinvestment for conventional franchised restaurants. Under our developmental license arrangement, licensees provide capital for the entire
business, including the real estate interest, and the Company has no capital invested. In addition, the Company has an equity investment in a limited number of affiliates that invest in real estate and operate or franchise restaurants within a market.

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: twinkly lights on the tube on 11/19/2010 12:13:04 MST Print View

Everyone that I know including myself that watches as little TV as possible begin to find TV to be repulsive. It is sickening to us.

However, when I used to watch it routinely it was easy to digest.

Is TV a bad drug?

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: twinkly lights on the tube on 11/19/2010 12:17:12 MST Print View

Interesting voting stats for 2010 US...

http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2010G.html

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: Re: rog t is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 12:25:18 MST Print View

We can read the Carbon Flame or go to Columbia and get an MA in Climate and Society. Carbon Flame is a better value.

http://www.columbia.edu/cu/climatesociety/director.html

The need for professionals who understand the links between climate and society is acute, and grows ever more so as human activity alters the global atmosphere. The Columbia M.A. in Climate and Society will give you the knowledge and skills to meet this need.

Three semesters of tuition
(total tuition for the
entire M.A. Program): $44,670
Fees (including health
insurance and $100 fee for international students only):
$3,729
Living expenses: $18,252
Personal expenses: $3,626
Books/Supplies: $2,000
Total estimated cost
of attendance for the
entire degree:

$72,277

Rick Dreher
(halfturbo) - MLife

Locale: Northernish California
Re: rog t is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 12:32:34 MST Print View

Perhaps you're confusing value with pricing. At $0.00, "Carbon Flame" is "fairly priced," as the price correctly matches the value.

What one does with their university education is entirely up to them.

Cheers,

Rick

Nick Gatel
(ngatel) - MLife

Locale: Southern California
Re: Re: twinkly lights on the tube on 11/19/2010 12:39:43 MST Print View

The reality beyond the enjoyable yet oversimplifed discussions is that trying to understand who owns what is baffling. This can easily be seen by picking any large global corporation and then going to their web site. Go to their Investor Relations. Look at their annual report.
----------------------------------------------------

Not too complicated. Franchisees get to use the trademarks and other marketing stuff. They have to abide with certain rules set out by the Franchisor. There are term limits, which usually can be renewed if conditions are met. Problem with a leasehold owned by the Franchisor is that if the master lease cannot be renewed, then the Francisee could lose the business. Many service stations operate in a similar way. Some dealers own the land and capital improvements, some are leased from the oil company. Some service stations are owned and operated by the oil company.

Here is a delima... Do you feel BP is a good company? If you think not, then you might not want to purchase ARCO gas. BP owns ARCO. Now if everyone boycotts a certain ARCO gas station, which might be owned by a small businessman, who loses? The local businessman. One station or a few hundred boycotts will not have a significant impact on BP. On the other hand, maybe the station owner did not make a good choice to partner up with BP or continue the business relation after BP bought ARCO in 2000, given their track record of environmental disasters and accidents. So what do you do? I do not buy ARCO gas and that has been my choice for many, many years... even before BP bought them.

Nick Gatel
(ngatel) - MLife

Locale: Southern California
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: rog t is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 12:43:51 MST Print View

The need for professionals who understand the links between climate and society is acute, and grows ever more so as human activity alters the global atmosphere.

-------------------------------------------------------

Maybe they should check their premise :)

Regarding cost and value...

George has correctly identified the value, irregardless of cost.

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: twinkly lights on the bp on 11/19/2010 12:58:00 MST Print View

from BP web site...

[exerpt]

As a global group, our interests and activities are held or operated through subsidiaries, jointly controlled entities or associates established in – and subject to the laws and regulations of – many different jurisdictions. These interests and activities covered two business segments in 2009: Exploration and Production and Refining and Marketing. BP’s activities in low-carbon energy are managed through our Alternative Energy business, which is reported within Other businesses and corporate.

[Other]

Other businesses and corporate comprises the Alternative Energybusiness, Shipping, the group’s aluminium asset, Treasury (which includes interest income on the group’s cash and cash equivalents), and corporate activities worldwide.

Edited by gmatthews on 11/19/2010 13:00:24 MST.

Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Re: rog t is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 12:59:39 MST Print View

Ramblin' Rick says:
At $0.00, "Carbon Flame" is "fairly priced," as the price correctly matches the value.


Thoughts for naught. Cheap at twice the price.

What one does with their university education is entirely up to them.

It's called 'outreach'. ;-)

George, the universty I work at offers an MA in 'Science Communication'. I decided it wasn't for me, though I was offered a place.

Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Re: Re: twinkly lights on the tube on 11/19/2010 13:06:39 MST Print View

George says:
Is TV a bad drug?


They say TV insults your intelligence.

It takes a Microsoft PC to really rub it in though.

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: no light either. on 11/19/2010 13:15:10 MST Print View

> if a corporation is ever found guilty of corporate manslaughter, who goes to jail?
Depending on the circumstances, the Board of Directors can be found personally liable in Australia. This applies mainly to a failure by the Board to enforce OHS regulations.

Cheers

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: rog t is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 13:30:04 MST Print View

>> Perhaps you're confusing value with pricing

Zappanian Clarification

Churchill: Madam, would you sleep with me for five million pounds?

Socialite: My goodness, Mr. Churchill… Well, I suppose… we would have to discuss terms, of course…

Churchill: Would you sleep with me for five pounds?

Socialite: Mr. Churchill, what kind of woman do you think I am?!

Churchill: Madam, we’ve already established that. Now we are haggling about the price.

churchhill

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: Nick is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 13:44:36 MST Print View

Rick,

You agree I'm sure that Nick is a good value for political and business knowledge?

It is fun to learn.

C'mon now put your Thinking Cap on tight : )

hat

George Matthews
(gmatthews) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: no light either. on 11/19/2010 13:54:34 MST Print View

Roger C,

In US too. I think this link works...

http://www.yalelawjournal.org/images/pdfs/729.pdf

Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Re: Re: putative World Government sets out it's stall on 11/19/2010 13:58:58 MST Print View

John Podesta of the Center for American Progress, Joseph Romm's compadre in propaganda (Remember him Rick?), thinks Obama should dispense with the niceties of democracy and start weilding executive power, as the american public are clearly too stupid to vote for the correct side:

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2010/11/executive_orders.html

Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: no light either. on 11/19/2010 14:01:46 MST Print View

> if a corporation is ever found guilty of corporate manslaughter, who goes to jail?
Depending on the circumstances, the Board of Directors can be found personally liable in Australia. This applies mainly to a failure by the Board to enforce OHS regulations.


Has it ever happened?

By the way Roger C, did you notice I'd found those NIWA legal action pdf's for you?

Miguel Arboleda
(butuki) - MLife

Locale: Kanto Plain, Japan
Re: no light either. on 11/19/2010 14:27:40 MST Print View

Um, guys, any chance you might take a second to delete the trailing "Re:'s" in the comment title when you post? Getting kind of hard to see on the "Recent Threads" and "Recent Posts" pages.

Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Re: no Re's on 11/19/2010 14:46:22 MST Print View

Sorry Miguel.

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Re: Re: rog t is a good educational value on 11/19/2010 16:35:31 MST Print View

> Churchill: Madam, would you sleep with me for five million pounds?

I thought that was George Bernard Shaw, actually.

cheers