I have great respect for my intellectual betters, they do good work, like this: What ocean heating reveals about global warming. If you read that 5 page article, and follow the various referenced links, you can skip probably the last 2 or 3 years of this thread, and have a better understanding in the process. In the area of climate heating/change, you can, as always, find our betters in this area at climatechange.org. That's a good place to keep up on the recent data, and also to see the latest denialist stuff debunked, with science and research, of which there is so much now that it is no longer possible to actually pretend that this thread's purpose has any. Spend your time reading the real data, it's interesting, and the research out there is excellent, every year more understanding is achieved, and it's present in basically all published work, something you'd never really suspect reading this thread, but that's why I don't spend time reading it, I'm interested in reality and the work off my betters in this field, not the endless waste of bytes and server capacity fake stuff like this spreads across the web.
I believe the recent pacific typhoon was the strongest ever recorded, not positive. Sandy was also impressive. While this thread drags on and on, in the real world, people are waking up and starting to take action.
It's easy to understand the motivations to try to ignore reality, cherry pick data, ignore all the actual research going on, they can be because ones career depends on not seeing the facts, it can be simple fear of fundamental change, it can be stupidity, it can be lots of things. And there is certainly a lot of debate ongoing, most of it revolving around the questions of how much heating, how bad the damage will be, how quickly, what happens when tipping points are crossed, etc. Since fixing it involves fundamental changes in our way of life, it's also very easy to understand why people want to pretend that some debate exists where none actually does, that's a standard technique now, create false poles then expect and demand that they be treated as part of the actual ongoing argument, tiresome for those of us actually trained in critical thinking, but there you have it, it's how humans are, nothing we say here will change that.
Probably better to stick to discussion the merits of 0.52 cuben over 0.74 I think, or fuel consumption of stoves, does Sil mist or is it just condensation being knocked loose by wind/rain?
Since there is now in the real world in the real actual scientific community essentially complete agreement on what is going on, the only debate being severity, speed, etc, there is no point in engaging people in 'debate' when there is no debate. It's a slow process gathering data, but not when your only agenda is to cherry pick and selectively quote, then it's easy, since no actual science is occurring, just some odd psychological event. I suggest going back to the days when the universe revolved around the earth, and watch how that change in thinking took place, it wasn't overnight, and I'm sure there were hundreds of rog types putting out learned tomes explaining how copernicus and galileo were wrong and the churches teachings were the truth. But that's how it goes. Used to be backpackers were sort of the most likely to care about the earth and so on, times change I guess.