Condensation fix for single wall tents ?
Display Avatars Sort By:
Mike Barney
(eaglemb) - F

Locale: AZ, the Great Southwest!
Re: Ion Mask on 11/08/2007 21:05:27 MST Print View

Actually, Richard Nisley wins, he nailed it first, I just looked at it from a business perspective and noticed they had VC involved.... Nice catch Richard.

Franco Darioli
(Franco) - M

Locale: Melbourne
Ion Mask : condensation fix ? on 11/08/2007 22:14:51 MST Print View

Thanks Mike. I did not see Richard's post, occasionally that happens when I surf the various threads.
And thank you Richard for your input. It will be interesting to see what happens with this one.
Maybe Roger can ask them some intelligent questions on our behalf. I have no technical expertise whatsoever to do that.
Franco

Woubeir (from Europe)
(Woubeir) - F - MLife
Re: Ion Mask on 11/10/2007 05:35:45 MST Print View

Roger,
I see an opportunity for an article about water repellency, water repellency treatments, durability issues, future developments and if they can deliver what they promise, ...
What about repellency based on the properties of the fabric itself (e.g. arc'teryx claimed to have a hyperhydrophobic and thus extremely repellent polyester face fabric for use in some of its gore-tex jackets although they seem to have production problems with it) ?
What can we exspect from nanotreatments, nanofibers, ... ?

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Re: Ion Mask on 11/10/2007 13:30:37 MST Print View

Hi Tom

> I see an opportunity for an article about water repellency, water repellency treatments, durability issues,
Yeah, so do I, but the test equipment to do this properly and objectively will be expensive.
Part of the problem here is that every company keeps its treatment **details** confidential, and only publishes that information which suits itself.
But never fear, we will keep it in mind.

> future developments and if they can deliver what they promise, ...
I can answer that one straight away: Nope. :-)

> What can we expect from nanotreatments, nanofibers, ... ?
Nano-results?

Cheers

Mike Barney
(eaglemb) - F

Locale: AZ, the Great Southwest!
Richard Nisley / Ion Mask on 11/10/2007 17:18:34 MST Print View

Richard seems to have a very good handle on this subject. Maybe he could help define some of the less expensive test for BPL for a gift certificate???

Just a thought.

MikeB

Woubeir (from Europe)
(Woubeir) - F - MLife
Re: Re: Ion Mask on 11/11/2007 06:41:09 MST Print View

Roger,
you could start with a theoretical outlay and keep the testing for a later date. I still feel there's a huge gap in knowledge about what repellents are, how they function based on composition or way they are integrated on/in a fabric, why getting durability is a problem, what properties of fibers/yarns/fabric weave influence durability and effectivity, should some (current or future) fabrics offer better performance, ... What are these nanorepellents and similar and how do they differ from from standard water repellents and most importantly why shouldn't we exspect them to be any better over time? Environmental concerns or public health are other points of interest. Or care instructions.
May we exspect to see repellents that keep on beading al day long, day after day?

A real comparable test seems pretty difficult to me at this time because some treatments are not available on consumerlevel so you would have to test complete garments and at that point thre are so many variables, it's hard to distinguish what you're testing. And personally, I feel that such a test would show little significant differences between treatments over the midterm or longterm: all inadequate.

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Re: Re: Ion Mask on 11/11/2007 13:16:05 MST Print View

Hi Tom

> you could start with a theoretical outlay and keep the testing for a later date. I still feel there's a huge gap in knowledge about what repellents are,
Wow ... Yeah, true, but it would be a big task. OK, noted.

> why getting durability is a problem
This I can briefly answer fairly simply. For a start, the polymers used at present are soft, and abrade off. Secondly, it is all about the *surface* of the polymer, and the surface can be contaminated with dirt and sweat so easily. Sweat is what killed the first version of GoreTex (Teflon without the PU film over it).

> Or care instructions.
This is also easy enough. You must use something like the Atsko Sports Wash to wash these fabrics. Ordinary detergents leave lots of residue which actually makes the situation worse, not better.

Yeah, there is plenty there for an article. A very long article!

Cheers