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Stove Help PLEASE!!!
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Kyle Purcell
(dufus934) - F

Locale: North Texas
Stove Help PLEASE!!! on 10/21/2007 12:25:42 MDT Print View

I have been driving myself mad this morning trying to get the cans of my stoves to fit into each other, and i seem to always manage to crimp or fold up one spot on the stove. I have tried the dilator tool on zen stoves and cutting slits in the edge. Nothing is working for me. I have made stoves before, but it has been a while. I just don't remember having this porblem last time. I'm would be very greatful for any and all help. Thanks!

Jason Klass
(jasonklass) - F

Locale: Parker, CO
Fitting Cans Together on 10/21/2007 12:43:05 MDT Print View

Hey Kyle,
Have you tried "stretching" of one of the pieces of the stove over an unopened Pepsi can?

Edited by jasonklass on 10/21/2007 12:43:54 MDT.

Kyle Purcell
(dufus934) - F

Locale: North Texas
stretching on 10/21/2007 12:55:08 MDT Print View

Jason,

The tool on the zen stoves website was suppose to stretch the can, but i don't know how long to leave it on there. how do you stretch a can when you do it?

Michael Skwarczek
(uberkatzen) - F

Locale: Sudamerica
dilator tool on 10/21/2007 15:42:56 MDT Print View

I hated the method with the slits and consistently tore or crimped the wall. Make the dilator as specified on zenstoves. You'll notice that as you press the dilator into the prepared stove bottom, the side wall will stretch to accommodate the tool. You'll also feel the air being compressed inside the stove bottom, making it difficult to press the tool down. Just continue to ease it down, using a slight, very slight, rocking/circular movement as you press the tool downward. This helps expand the wall. You only need to go about 5-10mm (depending on the stove design) down and you don't leave the dilator in place. Done.

Good luck. Which stove are you making?

-Michael

Edited by uberkatzen on 10/21/2007 18:46:10 MDT.

Kyle Purcell
(dufus934) - F

Locale: North Texas
which stove? answer on 10/21/2007 20:57:13 MDT Print View

Michael,
I'm making the pressureized side burner stove, but I'm using a thumb skrew instead if the threaded rivet. That is also giving me some problems. The threads don't seem to hold. Plus I can't keep the stove lit. To me, it doesn't seem to be getting enough oxygen, but I have followed the directions. I don't know what's going on.

Denis Hazlewood
(redleader) - MLife

Locale: Luxury-Light Luke on the Llano Azul
Re: which stove? answer on 10/21/2007 22:05:32 MDT Print View

I would guess that your inability to keep the stove lit is that it doesn't stay hot enough to keep the alcohol vaporizing. How do you prime the stove?

Regarding the Thumb Screw: If you are trying to get the thumb screw to "thread" through the thin aluminum, the hole has to be just a tad on the small side so you have to use a little force to get it screwed in the first time. I'd just go with a 6-32 aluminum rivet nut and use a maximum quarter inch long cap screw. This combination probably won't weigh that much more than a thumb screw, given the size of the thumbscrew head.

I've probably made a hundred of stoves this way and it works great.

Edited by redleader on 10/21/2007 22:20:48 MDT.

Michael Skwarczek
(uberkatzen) - F

Locale: Sudamerica
RE: Stove Help PLEASE!!! on 10/22/2007 02:04:39 MDT Print View

Kyle,

If your threading is causing a pressure leak, you are going to have trouble maintaining heat and priming for the final burn.

The stove design you're pursuing is probably one of the most difficult. Which design are you following? Step back a moment and check out this other high pressure stove:

http://www.csun.edu/~mjurey/penny.html#

When you return to your previous pursuit, check out zenstove.net and try a threaded pop rivet or using JB Weld to adhere an appropriate nut for your thumb screw to the underside of the top section.

cheers,

-Michael

Edited by uberkatzen on 10/22/2007 02:12:20 MDT.

Kyle Purcell
(dufus934) - F

Locale: North Texas
Re: RE: Stove Help PLEASE!!! on 11/25/2007 23:30:34 MST Print View

Thanks for the info a while back Michael, but I am still having problems getting the thumb screw to stay in place.

This is the first time I have really played with these stoves since my last month long session with them, but I am still having problems. When i just drill a hole and run it through, it works fine for the first few uses, but then the hole gets too stretched out and the thumb screw won't stay in place and i lose pressure. If i try to JB weld a nut to the inside to hold the thumb screw, the JB weld melts and stinks! I am using the red and black "original" stuff.

Anyone who knows a solution to my problem let me know, it would be much appreciated.

Andrew :-)
(terra) - F

Locale: Sydney, Australia.
keep trying and be patient... on 11/26/2007 03:47:20 MST Print View

I have no special tools and it was a slow process. I bent the very lip of the inner half inward with small pliers so it wouldn't catch on the outer half. I then stretched the outer half by pushing it down onto the bottom of another can - sort of put it on crooked then roll it around whilst keeping pressure on it and it will stretch.
Then 'ease' the outer half onto the inner by slowly turning it around and around and gently pushing down. It only just went on a millimeter or two the first time.
Then I took it off and did it again, and again, and again.
When the two halves would go on squarely, and past the lip, I started to apply a little more pressure.
Once again I would pull them apart and re-fit them numerous times. Each time would stretch them more. If you rush it the inner will crease and collapse.
Now they are a firm hand press fit and ready for heat proof epoxy... when I find some.
(If you know where I can buy JB-Weld in Sydney Australia, please pipe up).

Matt Mahaney
(Matt_Mahaney) - MLife

Locale: In the District
Re: Re: RE: Stove Help PLEASE!!! on 11/26/2007 04:58:02 MST Print View

Kyle,
I am no stove maker, however, Tinny of Mini Bull Design may be able to help. He seems to be the stove maker. Lots of different types of stoves. I own his Elite #2. It is a pressurized stove with a priming wick. I have had no problems with it and I've used it for about 80 meals. Tinny is a real nice guy.

http://www.minibulldesign.com/index.htm

Good luck with the stove.
Matt

george carr
(hammer-one) - F

Locale: Walking With The Son
Re: Re: RE: Stove Help PLEASE!!! on 11/26/2007 14:02:18 MST Print View

Kyle,

Try Northern Tool to find a low cost threaded rivet tool. Nothing beats a threaded rivet for the type of stove you're trying to build.

George

Vick Hines
(vickrhines) - F

Locale: Central Texas
Re: Re: Re: RE: Stove Help PLEASE!!! on 11/27/2007 17:48:23 MST Print View

Kyle,
All these are good advice, but first, heat the can you plan to expand hot enough to darken the coating. That should be enough to anneal it so it will expand instead of splitting. Simple.

Adam Kilpatrick
(oysters) - MLife

Locale: South Australia
Re: keep trying and be patient... on 11/27/2007 19:32:16 MST Print View

Andrew,
Ive had the same problem in Adelaide. Couldnt find JB weld anywhere. im sure there are other high heat tolerant epoxys around if you look though.

I also had trouble finding the high heat resistant 3M tape that some people use on their stoves. I eventually rang 3M, and they don't import it to Australia. They did send me a sample of a fiberglass tape that also has high heat resistance (for free). It works Ok...the first couple of burns it caught alight...but after that it didnt any more, and still seemed to maintain its structural integrity.

But I think with practice you dont need JB weld or tape for a simple pepsi can stove...I only use it just in case-I dont want the halves to pop apart in the donga.